WWW.PANTHERNATION.COM
GO PANTHERS!
welcome

Welcome to the best UNI Panther forum on the net!

Become a PN Supporting Member! Get exclusive access to the Panther Den forum and more. Click here for info.

30-minute show exclusively highlighting UNI Athletics. Click here for info.

  • You need to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed.
  • To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
  • If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the help page by clicking this link.
  • If you have any questions please use the Contact Us form.
This website is not affiliated with the University of Northern Iowa or the UNI Panther Athletic Program.

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

West Gym news

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    Originally posted by vbfan19 View Post
    I hadn't heard about their league change (then again, I don't really follow D2 that closely).
    I looked up an article about it and this snippet caught my eye...

    so 83% of the students actually on campus are student athletes. That seems rather unusual.
    It's a really good move for them. Their average trip is still in the same ballpark but instead of going to where there aren't people, they're going to play where there are people. That's big for their online and satellite campus model. Obviously D2 athletics don't get a ton of publicity but if they can even pick up 10 more online students per year than they are now, it's a big win.

    As to the second thing, the campus in Fayette would have shuttered years ago without athletics. A town of less than 1200 with no bars or restaurants doesn't exactly attract your average college student.
    #MACtion

    Comment


    • #77
      Originally posted by BCPanther View Post
      As to the second thing, the campus in Fayette would have shuttered years ago without athletics. A town of less than 1200 with no bars or restaurants doesn't exactly attract your average college student.
      Dt's Pub on Main St isn't there anymore?

      Comment


      • #78
        Originally posted by vbfan19 View Post
        I hadn't heard about their league change (then again, I don't really follow D2 that closely).
        I looked up an article about it and this snippet caught my eye...

        so 83% of the students actually on campus are student athletes. That seems rather unusual.
        UIUs percentage is high, but that’s not all that uncommon in small, especially private, schools.

        look at pretty much any D3 in Iowa. All of them under 1500-2000 students

        Wartburg, for example, reports 1,444 students enrolled. They also report that 850 of them are student athletes. That’s 60% of their total enrollment being on an athletics team.

        Coe lists 1300 students and 600 of them are student athletes.

        Luther is the least student athlete heavy at 1700 students and about 600 student athletes.

        the majority of small private schools at any level of college run about 40-60% student athletes for total enrollment. That obviously doesn’t include large private schools like Notre Dame, USC, Baylor, etc. but if you look at any private achool (especially those with football) at the FCS or lower level you’ll see similar numbers.


        To put those numbers into perspective at a public, D1 school it would give

        Most every Valley school about 6000-8000 athletes student athletes
        Most Big 10 schools about 20,000 athletes

        yet most everyone of those schools will fall in the 600-1000 athlete range. Michigan - who is in the higher end of student athletes and enrollment - has less than 1000 student athletes as of 2019.

        it’s why people laugh at those who say colleges and universities would survive, and thrive, without athletics.

        the post secondary education system would crumble and be unrecognizable within 5 years if athletics were pulled.


        to go back to UNI related thoughts in this - UNI women’s wrestling would be great for the AD and the university. 10 scholarships in cost but there will be 30 girls rostered. That is 20 students paying their own tuition compared to 10 scholarships. That’s an enrollment gain and tuition gain. It also gains alumni and donors.

        Comment


        • #79
          Many small private colleges are mostly athletes these days. At least UIU is D2 and offers scholarships. Most others offer roster spots to mediocre high school athletes who are exited to be on any college roster and eventually leave with significant private college tuition debt.
          __________________
          The McLoud Center -Bob Lutz, Wichita Eagle, 2/3/2010

          Comment


          • #80
            Already found the move to the McLeod giving us the fruit of AD Harris' decision. Attendance the other evening was 2,300-2,400, while, as we know, the West Gym was bursting at the seams at 2,000.

            PLUS, and the BEST feature, LOTS of elbow room for me and no need to get there one hour before!

            Comment


            • #81
              Originally posted by A Fan In Lean Years View Post
              Already found the move to the McLeod giving us the fruit of AD Harris' decision. Attendance the other evening was 2,300-2,400, while, as we know, the West Gym was bursting at the seams at 2,000.

              PLUS, and the BEST feature, LOTS of elbow room for me and no need to get there one hour before!
              There is no "good" argument to rebut this. I'm glad you had a good experience.

              I was wrong about attendance at Wyoming which was 2,346. I imagine the high school wrestler deal thing helped attendance (and those athletes were let in for free). I thought they'd draw less than 2k for a Thursday night school against a no-name opponent (yes I am aware that they are old WWC rivals, but does the average fan remember the WWC anymore?). The dual against Cal Baptist is the only other dual against a no-name at home this season, so that will be another good test to see how many they can draw.

              There is plenty of evidence that there will be fewer than 2,000 fans for many duals in the McLeod Center.

              The West Gym provides atmosphere, no matter how many fans are there, McLeod doesn't. For me, that's enough. There are at least a dozen things I could name that UNI could do (but apparently has no interest in actually implementing) to help create an atmosphere in McLeod, but all that stuff has been covered to death on here. But I will start with one - the tarp that's on the floor and the restrictive sections for the wrestlers on the north end of the court. Find a better way to seat people around the mat, if that is what's needed. The ISU dual last year was crazy and it started with the wrestlers on the side of the mat.

              Comment


              • #82
                Even when they were still in the West Gym there were many duals that didn't draw 2,000, so to hold the McLeod to that standard isn't really a fair comparison.

                However, when there are more than 2,000, which is often, the McLeod will always be better financially for UNI.

                I can promise you that the mighty Cal Baptist isn't drawing 2,000 to any UNI facility.

                Comment


                • #83
                  Originally posted by A Fan In Lean Years View Post
                  Even when they were still in the West Gym there were many duals that didn't draw 2,000, so to hold the McLeod to that standard isn't really a fair comparison.

                  However, when there are more than 2,000, which is often, the McLeod will always be better financially for UNI.

                  I can promise you that the mighty Cal Baptist isn't drawing 2,000 to any UNI facility.
                  It is 100% fair, as it is my entire point. With 1,000-1,500 fans in West Gym, you still had an atmosphere, you still had a home-mat advantage. The crowd was still on top of you, you could still blow the roof off the place.

                  With 1,000-1,500 fans in McLeod you're just wrestling in a big, empty arena, just like 80% of wrestling squads across the country. Wooooooo.....

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Also, when an arena is 75% full it looks a heck of a lot better than when an arena is 21% full, no matter what the venue is.

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by DomeIsHome View Post
                      Also, when an arena is 75% full it looks a heck of a lot better than when an arena is 21% full, no matter what the venue is.
                      Have you considered his elbows?
                      #MACtion

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Originally posted by DomeIsHome View Post

                        There is no "good" argument to rebut this. I'm glad you had a good experience.

                        I was wrong about attendance at Wyoming which was 2,346. I imagine the high school wrestler deal thing helped attendance (and those athletes were let in for free). I thought they'd draw less than 2k for a Thursday night school against a no-name opponent (yes I am aware that they are old WWC rivals, but does the average fan remember the WWC anymore?). The dual against Cal Baptist is the only other dual against a no-name at home this season, so that will be another good test to see how many they can draw.

                        There is plenty of evidence that there will be fewer than 2,000 fans for many duals in the McLeod Center.

                        The West Gym provides atmosphere, no matter how many fans are there, McLeod doesn't. For me, that's enough. There are at least a dozen things I could name that UNI could do (but apparently has no interest in actually implementing) to help create an atmosphere in McLeod, but all that stuff has been covered to death on here. But I will start with one - the tarp that's on the floor and the restrictive sections for the wrestlers on the north end of the court. Find a better way to seat people around the mat, if that is what's needed. The ISU dual last year was crazy and it started with the wrestlers on the side of the mat.
                        I'd push the mat as far north as I possibly could, black out the south half of the building and not allow any seating past the 'half court' sections to try to make it feel smaller.

                        However, that doesn't at all work for meets during daylight with how bright that building is (same complaint I have for basketball, fwiw). The building desperately needs graphics on the north and south windows that will both block out the light and make the building look like something other than grey nothingness when you drive down Hudson Rd. That is inexpensive and would make a WORLD of difference.
                        #MACtion

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Originally posted by BCPanther View Post

                          I'd push the mat as far north as I possibly could, black out the south half of the building and not allow any seating past the 'half court' sections to try to make it feel smaller.

                          However, that doesn't at all work for meets during daylight with how bright that building is (same complaint I have for basketball, fwiw). The building desperately needs graphics on the north and south windows that will both block out the light and make the building look like something other than grey nothingness when you drive down Hudson Rd. That is inexpensive and would make a WORLD of difference.
                          A curtain is something Hilton uses for wrestling on occasion, if only that was something UNI could afford...

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            Originally posted by DomeIsHome View Post

                            It is 100% fair, as it is my entire point. With 1,000-1,500 fans in West Gym, you still had an atmosphere, you still had a home-mat advantage. The crowd was still on top of you, you could still blow the roof off the place.

                            With 1,000-1,500 fans in McLeod you're just wrestling in a big, empty arena, just like 80% of wrestling squads across the country. Wooooooo.....
                            Well, my point was that any time we can get over 2,000 into the McLeod, it's a win-win for all. More revenue than what you'll get for 2,000, so it'll always be a financial advantage.

                            Atmosphere is a separate issue, but we also have to accept that, with some exceptions, rasslin occurs in arenas and basketball facilities on almost every other campus. Somehow, they're still drawing in recruits with apparent, "bad atmospheres. " UNI can too.

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Originally posted by BCPanther View Post

                              Have you considered his elbows?
                              Then ban me again, like you've done twice before, if my words are so dangerous to you.

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Originally posted by A Fan In Lean Years View Post

                                Well, my point was that any time we can get over 2,000 into the McLeod, it's a win-win for all. More revenue than what you'll get for 2,000, so it'll always be a financial advantage.

                                Atmosphere is a separate issue, but we also have to accept that, with some exceptions, rasslin occurs in arenas and basketball facilities on almost every other campus. Somehow, they're still drawing in recruits with apparent, "bad atmospheres. " UNI can too.
                                This is actually an interesting point. Even Penn State doesn't wrestle its home duals in its basketball arena, with one-ish exception every season. It would be interesting to see how many schools don't wrestle in their main basketball arena. (Minnesota, Wisconsin, Michigan State, Penn State, Michigan, Indiana, Purdue, Nebraska, off the top of my head from the Big 10, do not. Missouri, NIU, UVU, UNC, Oklahoma, from other conferences do not)

                                While you are correct in that anytime UNI can get over 2000 in McLeod, its more of a win financially. But as I've said, unless they're bringing in at least 4k (more than half capacity anyway) I do not think its worth it to move the dual out of the West Gym. In a borderline dual like the Wyoming one, where there were (presumably) many free tickets given away, the financial compensation lies in concession/merch sales.

                                I don't really want to, but I probably should go back and pull the numbers from duals from the last three-four years (probably excluding 2020-21). I don't think there have been THAT many sellouts in West Gym since 2017 to rationalize making the jump to McLeod (I'm completely disregarding the "structural improvements" that the university says are needed in the West Gym).

                                We're never going to agree on this, and I'm probably not going to let it go for a while. The idea that there "...is a timeframe, as far as, being able to train in here [West Gym]," and NOBODY has announced ANYTHING about that in over a year is absurd and borderline negligent. The optics of, well we can't have people in here anymore because its unsafe, but classes, dance team, heck even the wrestling squad, etc. get to use the building still is hypocritical at best and again, negligent at worst. The athletic department and university should be ashamed of how they have treated the wrestling program, especially because Schwab CHOSE UNI over a much bigger job just a year and a half ago.

                                There are some very basic things that could be done to McLeod to make it better for wrestling (and all the other sports played there). It's been two YEARS, and seemingly nothing has been done. I am baffled.

                                Side note: next year, when Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, and Iowa State all don't come to Cedar Falls....yikes.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X