UNI Football on TV

[06panther10]

Re: UNI Football on TV

well, the ndsu/iowa had 50,000 attendance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Trice_Stadium

The current record for single-game attendance, 56,795, was set on September 8, 2007 when the Cyclones hosted Northern Iowa.

btw, we also won the game.

[jegbomb52]

Re: UNI Football on TV

Enlighten me what Marshall (had a couple decent years with Leftwich), Troy, Nevada, and FAU have done. Boise is the extreme exception.

Troy, Nevada, and FAU command over $750,000 per one time road date (money game), they are looked at as "D-I" nationally, not just by a few die hard fans on a message board, and they run their football program in the black by hundreds of thousands of dollars each year.

Look, I am not saying that FBS is the way to go. I have enjoyed being I-AA for years. I am just saying we have an oppoortunity with all of the re-allignment (especially with conference like the MAC allowing football only members and the Valley allowing all sports except football) we need to take a serious look at it.

One thing is for certain, we are not going to go into any more debt because of making the jump. The worst case scenario (I think) is that we stay financially where we are at with POTENTIAL to go higher. As far as I-AA is concerned we are where we are.

[Panthers to the Bone]

Re: UNI Football on TV

Two things:
The UNI/SIU game is going to be on national tv: Fox College Sports

Also, if UNI were to go FBS, and were to keep an 8 team conference (4 home/4 road games), they would most likely play 3 FBS non-con games (Big 10 and 12 schools buying UNI in for $700K+) and maybe initially 2-for-1's with MAC schools like NIU, Ball State, Miami-Ohio, etc... They would also play an FCS buy game.

Most likely, the amount UNI would pay for the FCS buy game would probably be equivalent (over a 2-3 year span) as that of traveling to NIU/Miami-Ohio/etc...and playing at home in that series. For example, if UNI paid Indiana State $100,000 to come to UNI for a game for 3 years ($300K total), it's probably about the same money that UNI would gain by playing on the road twice against those MAC schools and at home once (13,000 paid attendance---not including students, x $25/ticket= $325,000).

So, if it comes down to playing 5 guaranteed home games a year, with every couple years UNI getting 6, and playing 2 BCS type games a year, does that benefit UNI more financially that it will once we get to playing 2 FBS games per year as an FCS school? Also, there is no guarantee that UNI gets a bowl game. And, $500K payout sounds nice, but then you have to factor in travel expenses, which lowers the payout.

I'm not saying it is or isn't beneficial making the jump, but based on a true breakdown in financials from a ticketing revenue and 'payout' money side of things (no increased tv dollars factored in---if there would be any), just an honest question on the benefit.

[Newsbreaker]

Re: UNI Football on TV

I think it is funny how you ultimately say people who push for FBS football are people who "don't know what they are talking about." You have no idea who the people on this board are or what their knowledge base or background is. So please, stop throwing out "don't know what they are talking about" slang just because someone opinion is different than yours.

First, it's not slang. Second, I don't have to know who the people on this board are (whether they actually have some role in the department or just think they know the landscape.) The thoughts they post show what they do, and do not, know and understand. Moreso than many other places, you stand on what you say and not "who you are" here, and on this subject, what some people say falls flat. Badly.

I was just going to bring up Marshall. They were a national name 15 years ago, winning National Championships and being the darling of IAA football. Now they are an afterthought in a league that is a joke. Boise State and Nevada are not comparable (though BSU has enjoyed great success - Nevada much less so). We aren't the only game for hundreds of miles like BSU and Nevada is (unless you could UNLV football, which not many people do). Nevada has not been viewed as "national." Marshall has not been viewed favorably on a "national" level since they made the jump, other than having a superstar college QB.

Hell, Iowa is barely viewed as a "national" program and they've finished in the top-10 with regularity over the past 10 years.

A game we have played in once. We might not get 15,000 to the dome every Saturday but we might continue to average 12,000 and pull hundreds of thousands of dollars more per year simply for being FBS when playing "money games" than I-AA.

Where is this money coming from? Is there some magic FBS slush fund that automatically awards schools who have transitioned some extra jack? Yes, you might get a half-mil (and spend most of it just going to the game) for a low-level, mid-december bowl game, but expenses also go WAY up. Extra schollys (and none of the split scholarships we enjoy at the FCS level), travel costs and other institutional fees make a huge difference.

Schools like us are the reason FCS football exists. We are the posterboy, and I for one am proud of that.

The "move up" people just don't know who we are. Knowing who you are isn't a limiting thing, it's a liberating thing. It allows you to move forward intelligently rather then wasting time and resources trying to pretend you're something you are not.

We have plenty of people that care enough about UNI, and about UNI being successful that would not allow that to happen.

I see what you're saying in your post, and I agree with some of it. That said, the "won't allow that to happen" is not realistic. Do you think there aren't people at Indiana State who care just as much as the people at UNI? How do they allow losing to happen there?

There is no such thing as "won't let that happen."

Ticket prices would go way up by necessity. Attendance would go down. Instead of being able to sell a national ranking and title aspirations we'd be selling SunBelt (or sub-Sunbelt) level football. Iowa and ISU fans know that level of football is a joke, and like it or not, we can't survive without people willing to support one of those schools and us at the same time. We lack the geography and the population for anything else to be true. (That isn't to say that all UNI fans have to like both, so don't stroke out, but to fill the dome there has to be "dual fans.") Those ISU/Iowa fans, however, do enjoy the FCS level of football. They see us doing more with less. They've seen us compete with them (while they blow the doors of teams from those sub-par FBS leagues) and respect what we do. Beyond that, tickets to UNI games are a great value. That all changes with a move.

The best thing that can be said against a move is the simplest: It only kills everything good about UNI football. Maybe that's done to grab imaginary dollars, maybe to stroke somebody's inferiority complex, but either way the result is the same.

[TH1974]

Re: UNI Football on TV

We have plenty of people that care enough about UNI, and about UNI being successful that would not allow that to happen.

I see what you're saying in your post, and I agree with some of it. That said, the "won't allow that to happen" is not realistic. Do you think there aren't people at Indiana State who care just as much as the people at UNI? How do they allow losing to happen there?

And you could ask the same question about WKU and Marshall, etc. I'd guess that before they moved up, they had fans saying, "We've been successful at FCS, and there's no reason we will fail at FBS. There are plenty of people who won't let that happen."

[SteinPizza]

Re: UNI Football on TV

News;

We might not get 15,000 to the dome every Saturday but we might continue to average 12,000 and pull hundreds of thousands of dollars more per year simply for being FBS when playing "money games" than I-AA.

I see your point Jeg, but wouldn't the reverse ring true? Wouldn't we have to issue the same guarantees to visiting teams ($350K a game, etc.)? Keep in mind we're probably talking a MAC or Sun Belt level entry to FCS, but those guarantees still have to be well into the hundreds of thousands of dollars. How could we afford that even if the Dome sold out every game? I highly doubt there'd be enough TV revenue to make up for it. And News did have a point - it's not like suddenly more Iowans would hop on the bandwagon, or more corporate dollars would suddenly flow in.

Also, for those who question the MAC, that's pretty good ball. It's not Big 12 or Big Ten level, but there are some good teams and players who come from there. Take a look sometime at the number of players who've been drafted from Northern Illinois, or made the league as FAs. That's a better program than Iowa State, as an example. And far better situated to be more competitive. MAC teams are also known to pull upsets (or nearly) just about every year over well regarded BCS teams (another indicator that the talent discrepancy isn't as bad as you'd think).

[06panther10]

Re: UNI Football on TV

I see what you're saying in your post, and I agree with some of it. That said, the "won't allow that to happen" is not realistic. Do you think there aren't people at Indiana State who care just as much as the people at UNI? How do they allow losing to happen there?

There is no such thing as "won't let that happen."

There is such a thing. If we were to ever look at FBS, I'm not advocating joining the sunbelt. There is doing things the right way, and there is doing things just for the sake of moving up (sunbelt). I don't know why you use Indiana State as an example. They are not UNI. Tradition is very important in making successful strides like this. Nobody cares at InSt about anything and never has, and that is why they suck at everything. That is not at all the case at UNI.

If we were to ever think about moving up, I'm positive the people at UNI would not allow us to join the freaking sun belt. I think that some sort of a "group move" with MSU, SIU, ISU etc, or a move to a semi-respectable football conference like the WAC or MAC could work.

But for the most part, I'm with you on this one. I love where we are at, and what we do here in the FCS. But I don't think you should simply dismiss an FBS move at UNI saying that we "can't" do it.

[Newsbreaker]

Re: UNI Football on TV

There are people who care at every school just as much as anyone at UNI.

Hell, look at Misssouri State or Western Illinois. They were once the class of the Gateway along with UNI. Now they're lucky to be a 3rd or 4th place team. Why did someone "let that happen."

Hell, let's just move to the Big Ten! Teams move up to where they are welcome, and we wouldn't be welcome in the WAC - probably not in the MAC - and we couldn't move as a group unless the league taking us all wanted to be 20 teams strong, and nobody wants that.

I like the "shooting for the stars" mentality, but it is completely disconnected from reality.

[Panther/Statesman]

Re: UNI Football on TV

The economic and demographic comparasins to other teams who've made the jump are valuable, as is all thoughful consideration to avoid fatal mistakes in strategy.

But consider this: When I was at UNI we made the jump to Division I in all sports (the idea was to compete on the MAC or Missouri Valley football level, then 1-AA was created) people said UNI sports would never compete at the D-1 level. Had we taken the advice of the naysayers and not made the jump, UNI would not be competing with Iowa and ISU in Bball, and the KU upset would never have happened.

At that time, UNI tailgating consisted of 4 or 5 vehichles in the booster lot south of the dome. We might draw 7 or 8 k to a game, occasionally breaking 10. Sports at UNI has taken a huge leap since those days, I still can't believe the scene on game day as I survey the tailgaters.

We have a nice niche now, but who's to say moving up isn't viable based on somewhat similar circumstances at other universities? In business, you find a way to grow or become marginalized. If our current situation brings thinly veiled threats from the BOR, then we aren't safe now. Maybe its time to explore a bold move.

I like the 'Panther Town' marketing of UNI. We need to be outrageous and paint every market in the state purple. People like a cocky outsider, and I heard an Iowa fan at the game last year comment to his friends that he was flabbergasted that UNI fans are so rabid for their team. Let push that, and be agressive. I'd rather go down fighting than clinging to the imagined safety of the status quo!

[06panther10]

Re: UNI Football on TV

The economic and demographic comparasins to other teams who've made the jump are valuable, as is all thoughful consideration to avoid fatal mistakes in strategy.

But consider this: When I was at UNI we made the jump to Division I in all sports (the idea was to compete on the MAC or Missouri Valley football level, then 1-AA was created) people said UNI sports would never compete at the D-1 level. Had we taken the advice of the naysayers and not made the jump, UNI would not be competing with Iowa and ISU in Bball, and the KU upset would never have happened.

At that time, UNI tailgating consisted of 4 or 5 vehichles in the booster lot south of the dome. We might draw 7 or 8 k to a game, occasionally breaking 10. Sports at UNI has taken a huge leap since those days, I still can't believe the scene on game day as I survey the tailgaters.

We have a nice niche now, but who's to say moving up isn't viable based on somewhat similar circumstances at other universities? In business, you find a way to grow or become marginalized. If our current situation brings thinly veiled threats from the BOR, then we aren't safe now. Maybe its time to explore a bold move.

I like the 'Panther Town' marketing of UNI. We need to be outrageous and paint every market in the state purple. People like a cocky outsider, and I heard an Iowa fan at the game last year comment to his friends that he was flabbergasted that UNI fans are so rabid for their team. Let push that, and be agressive. I'd rather go down fighting than clinging to the imagined safety of the status quo!

Great points.

You bring up an important point that people sometimes forget. UNI is growing. And who's to say it won't continue to grow for the next 20 years? Look at where we were just, say, 10-15 years ago to what we have now.

[jegbomb52]

Re: UNI Football on TV

The only reason we know anything about Marshall's I-AA prowess is because we follow a powerful I-AA team. The rest of the nation knows not, and cares not about what Marshall has done. They see Marshall as a contender that they were for a 4-5 year period when dominating the MAC and winning a few bowl games and producing players like Leftwitch, Pennington, Moss (all of which I believe graduated from Marshall when they were FBS).

[Newsbreaker]

Re: UNI Football on TV

The only reason we know anything about Marshall's I-AA prowess is because we follow a powerful I-AA team. The rest of the nation knows not, and cares not about what Marshall has done. They see Marshall as a contender that they were for a 4-5 year period when dominating the MAC and winning a few bowl games and producing players like Leftwitch, Pennington, Moss (all of which I believe graduated from Marshall when they were FBS).

This is categorically untrue. When Randy Moss was running all over for the Thundering Herd, America knew about it. It was Moss and McNair who were the face of IAA football to the country in the mid-90's. Were they following it like they follow the BCS leagues? No, but the country knew what they were and what they were doing.

That is less true today. They are also-rans in a league of nobodies. A memory.

[JayJ79]

Re: UNI Football on TV

Randy Moss signed a LOI to play for Notre Dame, but then got involved in a racially-charged fight at his high school which left some people in the hospital, after which ND denied his admissions application.

So he went to Florida State, where he redshirted for the '95 season (due to transfer rules). Got busted for pot smoking while on probation, which got him kicked out of FSU, so he transfered to Marshall and started playing there in '96, which was the last year Marshall was a I-AA program. And during that year, Marshall defeated UNI 31-14 in the semifinals of the playoffs, on route to a 15-0 season and a national championship.

The Thundering Herd moved to I-A the following year, where Moss and Chad Pennington went 10-3, Winning the East Division of the MAC and playing in the Motor City Bowl, where they lost to Ole Miss.

[TH1974]

Re: UNI Football on TV

Randy Moss signed a LOI to play for Notre Dame, but then got involved in a racially-charged fight at his high school which left some people in the hospital, after which ND denied his admissions application.

So he went to Florida State, where he redshirted for the '95 season (due to transfer rules). Got busted for pot smoking while on probation, which got him kicked out of FSU, so he transfered to Marshall and started playing there in '96, which was the last year Marshall was a I-AA program. And during that year, Marshall defeated UNI 31-14 in the semifinals of the playoffs, on route to a 15-0 season and a national championship.

The Thundering Herd moved to I-A the following year, where Moss and Chad Pennington went 10-3, Winning the East Division of the MAC and playing in the Motor City Bowl, where they lost to Ole Miss.

This.



..

[lakesbison]

Re: UNI Football on TV

I miss randy moss, wish he'd come back to the vikings!!