I hate the 3 point basket

[9YRPLAN]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

um...the alternating possession?

[9YRPLAN]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

or we can alternate between a jump ball and a dropped ball. the shorter player may have the advantage on a dropped ball. LOL

you are missing my point entirely. a short player can make a great play by tying up a big man who doesnt keep the ball high. if this is a jump ball situation, you are NOT rewarding good defense. you are rewarding height. a large number of held ball situations occur under the basket.

[jman2004]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

if this is a jump ball situation, you are NOT rewarding good defense. you are rewarding height. a large number of held ball situations occur under the basket.

Excellent point. Isn't this precisely why they DON'T really do jump balls anymore? It was always kind of unfair to begin with.

[Khan4Cats]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

or we can alternate between a jump ball and a dropped ball. the shorter player may have the advantage on a dropped ball. LOL

you are missing my point entirely. a short player can make a great play by tying up a big man who doesnt keep the ball high. if this is a jump ball situation, you are NOT rewarding good defense. you are rewarding height. a large number of held ball situations occur under the basket.

You are rewarding height over defense which is why the rule change was made. That's the whole point of this thread though, the game has evolved to be a "short" man's game by rewarding an extra point for shooting from farther out. It used to be also that teams did a jump ball after every made basket. That always favored the team with the tallest player as well.
The game is different now, you have to have guards that can make things happen. We had that when we had the combination options of Brooks, Benny J, Erik, J-Lit and more so when we had Foster as well. Right now we really need either Brown or Reed to step up and make their experience matter or find it in Dunham or Montgomery, both of whom look afraid to shoot at times.

[9YRPLAN]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

let me pose this question-

is wooden truly the greatest basketball mind ever, or did the era during which he earned his accolades simply disproportionately favor the big man?

i dont have an opinion, im just curious. I do think that the three pointer has made the game more competitive and balanced.

[Khan4Cats]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

I think Wooden was a great motivator and leader. That translated into athletic success for his teams. Yes, he had great big men, but he also won with very good guards and excellent "team" concept basketball. I've read a couple books either about him or by him and he has a great mind for organization, motivation, and the ability to achieve the peak from his teams.

Was always interested in the fact that he had two interviews to be a head coach, one at UCLA, the other at Minnesota. But that his trip to Minnesota was delayed by weather and he was afraid that if he waited fr the re-scheduled interview the UCLA job might close so he went with it. What might have been.

Kind of like how Iowa State hesitated in making an offer to a young coach from Army in the late 70's. Somebody named Kryszsysyskzxkjei or something like that. Not that they didn't do bad with Johnny Orr, but what might have been.

[in_the_stands]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

Good question. I think it's harder for a big man to dominate in todays game, but I don't think that's because of the 3 point rule. So, I guess by extension, I'm saying the big man was favored in Wooden's era (somewhat).

I think what keeps players like Egleseder (for example) from putting up 50 points every night is a combination of help defense that everyone preaches now, plus the big man is either going against a same-size big man, or else a shorter but stockier/stronger opponent who can push the big man off balance and out of position, without fouling out (as would usually happen 30-40 years ago) due to more inside contact permitted in todays game (IMHO).

The post-Wooden 3-point rule is more effective at keeping everybody from packing 5 defenders in the paint (ala Dr.Tom's Iowa teams), without regard to whether the defense has a big man or not.

That's my view, anyway.

[GonzoCat]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

I think now that we've taken away the natural advantage the big man has in basketball we should look at taking away some of the other natural advantages in sports to make them more fair also.

Hell big men have an advantage in a lot of sports and really in life in general. They get more women and they get better jobs, this is all really unfair.

Take your pitcher that can throw 95+ mile an hour balls. Most of them are big. And even if they aren't big they've got a natural advantage over most players. Lots of guys just can't hit that fast of ball. They should have to wear some sort of sling that slows down their pitch, or pitch underhand.

Look at football, man most of those guys are huge. Sure you see some pretty short running backs and dbacks, but what if a little guy wants to play on the line? We should mandate that 2 positions on the line cannot be over 5-10 or 180 lbs.

And look at track, guys who are fast have a natural advantage. They should have to run in mud so slow guys have a chance to excel at the sport too.

Wrestling does try to be fair with it's weight classes, but still strong guys definitely have a natural advantage which doesn't seem fair at all. Maybe the weight classes should be based on how much you can bench as opposed to how much you actually weigh.

See, I can play the absurd game also. I know they aren't going to take away the 3 point basket, but if they don't do more to keep the game from becoming so heavily weighted towards it the game will continue to decline in popularity.

If nothing else, I started a couple threads that got people talking about something besides EC starting or not.

[BryceC]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

There have been numerous books written on the fact that Wooden also benefitted from getting great players who were paid by boosters. I mean that helps and everything too.

[Newsbreaker]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

You're an odd cat Gonzo.

[BCPanther]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

Great Bull Durham reference 2317...

Best Movie Ever!!

[GonzoCat]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

You're an odd cat Gonzo.

Says the guy who made not 1, but 3 posts in this thread about going back to peach baskets, no score board, wooden tennis rackets and eliminating the forward pass, etc.

You like to get absurd, but you don't like it thrown back at you.

[jman2004]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

But Gonzo, the whole point of basketball is to get the ball into the hoop. It's more difficult to make a three pointer than it is a lay-up, that's why the rule was adopted. It's not necessarily an advantage to the "little man", it's an advantage to "anyone" who can shoot the three. Good three point shooters in basketball are not only HORSE players. There is such a thing as creating their own shots as well.

Big men shoot from the arc as well. That adds an interesting dimension to the game, considering their defenders have to come out and guard them.

I think from your sarcastic post that you were inferring that basketball started out as a sport for tall people but because of the three point line now ANYONE can play and that it should go back to being for Big Men because gosh darnit, that's the way it began. That's not the case.

Plus, usually, this isn't a big deal. A good basketball team, a quality, championship calibre basketball team, is sound at every position. You're not going to win championships on a regular basis, or ball games for that matter by living and dying by the three ball. That's just not true. You're going to win games and championships when your guards can penetrate and shoot from the outside and when your big men rebound and score physical baskets down low . . . all while playing defense.

If the three point line has really ruined the game, I'd be starting for UNI right now, because I ROCK at HORSE!

[jman2004]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

But a dunk can totally depend on your height. A three pointer can't. I'd be okay with a dunk being worth more, but what happens when Brian Haak gets a steal at midcourt and goes coast to coast only to lay it in because he can't dunk. That's not fair . . .

[Newsbreaker]

Re: I hate the 3 point basket

Says the guy who made not 1, but 3 posts in this thread about going back to peach baskets, no score board, wooden tennis rackets and eliminating the forward pass, etc.

You like to get absurd, but you don't like it thrown back at you.

I wasn't being absurd, I was mocking you. There's a difference.