Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

[TH1974]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

I'm referring to Mac at ISU. He had prior experience, was a winner coming in, and yet did not succeed at ISU. It's possible that any hire you'd deem qualified could have found a similarly dismal outcome for the Cyclones.

Johnny Orr, Tim Floyd, and Larry Eustachy were all pretty successful in Ames with their previous experience.

[Panther789]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

No, it's not, but it's unlikely. Plus, for a fan base that 36 hours ago wanted a guy with "experience" and "past success" who preferably was a "big name" the glee with which they're accepting a guy who has absolutely none of that is hilarious.

Not really.

A poll conducted on CycloneFanatic, a place where one might presume support would be the highest:

63% would not have made the hire.

http://www.cyclonefanatic.com/forum/mens-basketball/89142-what-do-you-think-hoiberg-hire-if-true.html

Read a few comments, and its pretty clear that board is split.

[cydave]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

You realize statements like this make my point, right? It illustrates that you're more interested in remembering good times than creating them.



That wasn't the story just a few short weeks ago. Plus, he's an agent! He knows people in the NBA! He played in the NBA! He knows what it takes to get there! Kids will be impressed with his NBA player credentials (which are about 45x's more impressive than Hoiberg's)! All he'd have to do is win!


The kids might be excited about downing 14 of those new KFC sandwiches in a single sitting, but that won't mean it's good for anybody.

Johnny Orr was just on KXNO. He is so excited that Fred is going to pack Hilton again. People will remember the old days! It's gonna be great.

So far as coaching goes, well 60 years ago Johnny took a small Wisconsin school to the state tournament in his first year coaching, and all he had to do was get the players together and "let them do what they want." (That was a direct quote). Fred should be fine without any coaching experience. It's not like coaching in this day and age in the Big XII Conference is any harder than a small Wisconsin town in the 50's.

I am officially expressing my interest in coaching at UNI. I would stay after success as well. I'm also going to run for mayor of my town and get a few votes. It will be great. I've now met half the qualifications 'ol Dave just thought were so important.

Hoiberg played in the NBA as well. Got coached by some big names. Was VP of operations for an NBA, so I'm pretty sure Fred knows what it taks to play in the NBA and what it takes to get there as well...

[UNIPNTHR]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

This is the dumbest of all arguments in this whole situation. The "Well, (insert names of coaches with experience here) had experience and they failed, so why *not* give the job to an inexperienced guy?" line is ridiculous.

It's a good thing that wasn't my assertion.

If you're looking for 'proof' in the form of links, how about providing three examples of successful major-college coaches who've had no prior coaching experience.

I asked for a link, because Newsbreaker commonly uses the line, "please provide a link showing xyz" knowing full well that a link either does not exist or would be irrelevant even if it did. I thought you'd have caught that, sorry for giving you that kind of credit.

[cydave]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

You realize statements like this make my point, right? It illustrates that you're more interested in remembering good times than creating them.



That wasn't the story just a few short weeks ago. Plus, he's an agent! He knows people in the NBA! He played in the NBA! He knows what it takes to get there! Kids will be impressed with his NBA player credentials (which are about 45x's more impressive than Hoiberg's)! All he'd have to do is win!



The kids might be excited about downing 14 of those new KFC sandwiches in a single sitting, but that won't mean it's good for anybody.

Johnny Orr was just on KXNO. He is so excited that Fred is going to pack Hilton again. People will remember the old days! It's gonna be great.

So far as coaching goes, well 60 years ago Johnny took a small Wisconsin school to the state tournament in his first year coaching, and all he had to do was get the players together and "let them do what they want." (That was a direct quote). Fred should be fine without any coaching experience. It's not like coaching in this day and age in the Big XII Conference is any harder than a small Wisconsin town in the 50's.

I am officially expressing my interest in coaching at UNI. I would stay after success as well. I'm also going to run for mayor of my town and get a few votes. It will be great. I've now met half the qualifications 'ol Dave just thought were so important.

[UNIPNTHR]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

Johnny Orr, Tim Floyd, and Larry Eustachy were all pretty successful in Ames with their previous experience.

Could you please miss the point more? I always thought you were a smart guy pretending to be dumb to make a point. Apparently you were just on a hot streak.

[TH1974]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

I asked for a link, because Newsbreaker commonly uses the line, "please provide a link showing xyz" knowing full well that a link either does not exist or would be irrelevant even if it did. I thought you'd have caught that, sorry for giving you that kind of credit.

So you *won't* be providing examples. Sorry for assuming you'd be able to.

[Newsbreaker]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

Hoiberg played in the NBA as well. Got coached by some big names. Was VP of operations for an NBA, so I'm pretty sure Fred knows what it taks to play in the NBA and what it takes to get there as well...

Sounds like he's perfectly suited to evaluating, recruiting and compiling talent in an NBA organization.

Unfortunately the Big XII hasn't been added as the third professional conference just yet, and getting kids to come to a college to play isn't anywhere near the same process as signing professionals to play. Thank the good Lord he's coming from what might be the worst professional organization in the NBA! At least you've got that!

FWIW, I ask for a link when one would prove useful. The links you asked for would not. I thought the whole "link" thing was pretty self-explanatory. I guess not.

[TH1974]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

Could you please miss the point more? I always thought you were a smart guy pretending to be dumb to make a point. Apparently you were just on a hot streak.

Sorry you weren't able to follow. Here's a revised back-and-forth:

I'm referring to Mac at ISU. He had prior experience, was a winner coming in, and yet did not succeed at ISU. It's possible that any hire you'd deem qualified could have found a similarly dismal outcome for the Cyclones.

Johnny Orr, Tim Floyd, and Larry Eustachy were all pretty successful in Ames with their previous experience, but that apparently doesn't matter to you. After you ignore that, consider that while it *is* possible that any hire Newsbreaker would deem qualified could have found a similar-to-McDermott-ly dismal outcome for the Cyclones, but that it's much *more* possible that someone with no experience would have the same dismal outcome.

[CincyPanther88]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

Hoiberg played in the NBA as well. Got coached by some big names. Was VP of operations for an NBA, so I'm pretty sure Fred knows what it taks to play in the NBA and what it takes to get there as well...

That's great if he's recruiting kids who are wanting to play in the NBA. However, his job is to recruit players to play - and hopefully (for him and Cyclone Nation) win - for Iowa State University. Those goals may be at cross-purposes to each other. And Fred's not the only coach who knows what it takes to get to the NBA.

It's a bit of a risk for Fred to take. If he doesn't win, his popularity is going to nosedive.

[UNIPNTHR]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

Johnny Orr, Tim Floyd, and Larry Eustachy were all pretty successful in Ames with their previous experience, but that apparently doesn't matter to you. After you ignore that, consider that while it *is* possible that any hire Newsbreaker would deem qualified could have found a similar-to-McDermott-ly dismal outcome for the Cyclones, but that it's much *more* possible that someone with no experience would have the same dismal outcome.

The only part I disagree with is the "After you ignore that".

[TH1974]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

The only part I disagree with is the "After you ignore that".

I'm sure .

[GonzoCat]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

And I assume you played in the NBA for 10 years as well? I also assume you have the same kind of connections that Hoiberg has with College and NBA across America? I assume you have the GM of every NBA team in your phone? I also assume that you have the knowledge, popularity, and charisma of Fred Hoiberg?

This isn't just some guy walking in off the street that got the job, Hoiberg is a walking legend for ISU. His connections, personality, and coaching plan got him the job. The players and recuits have stated how excited they are to play for Fred and also love that he was in the NBA for 10 years and has the connections that they like to hear about.

No, I didn't play past bb past junior high, I stated as much in the post you quoted. If you are going to quote something learn to first read it. That lack of playing experience notwithstanding, you cannot completely rule out the possibility that I could be an outstanding coach for ISU, but the odds are I would not. Similarly the odds are Fred won't, but anything is possible. Good luck, I like the hire. Odds are it means ISU will continue to be a non-factor in bb among Iowa universities, which helps UNI.

I said before Fred is tremendously popular in the greater Ames area. Anywhere else in the country, not so much. I am more popular with my friends who are not ISU fans than him, and on a good day my wife would say I have more charisma. Of course she, like 99.999% of the populace would not know who Fred is.

This move isn't without precedent, Houston tried something similar with Clyde Drexler a decade or so ago. That worked out pretty well. The glide had a much more successful college and NBA career, was selected as one of the top 50 players in NBA history, was about 100 times more well known on a national basis, and had a major metro area where he was worshiped to recruit in. All he had to do was win.

[Purrrrrfect]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

You're right. He and I are in the same boat. One of us was just given a Power League HC job, however.

He does have draft experience. Granted that draft was a disaster, and he works for an organization that has found a way to be in the NBA Draft Lottery for 5 consecutive years (and has averaged 25 wins a year while he's been there), so I guess he has that going for him.

The word "operations" is funny. I'm sure the ISU program in the coming years will excel from the "operations" standpoint. Truly outstanding. That doesn't do much to win games, but they'll be operationally All American.



I think it's fair to consider the following things in the definition of coaching, and they might even be the most important:

*Recruiting players, which means more than selecting them off a board and then opening a check book. It's going to mean actually identifying players and then convincing them to come play for you when they have many alternatives.

*Running a practice. You know, getting ready to play the game of basketball.

*Producing a game plan. Scouting the other team, identifying how your team can best compete against them, devising a way to do that and then implementing it.

*Directing players during a game against another competitive team.

Now just imagine how excited Ames would be today if Hoiberg had any experience doing any of that! He'd be quite the catch.

All that really needs to be said about this comes from John Walters:

Q: Would Hoiberg have been hired at any other program in the country?
A: No.

1. Recruiting...that comes with time and good assistants...anyone can recruit, just like I would for women if I were single...pro's, con's, what can she bring to the table, etc. Recruiting is just about selling yourself and the program. Won't be hard to do with NBA accolades (sp?) and a superior collegiate career.

2. Running a practice? Really? You don't think in all his years as a player they had athlete-ran practices? He is a guard, like a floor-general, has to operate things on the whim.

3. Like #2, he's probably scouted more film of one NBA game than you and I both have in our entire careers...(exaggerated, but you know what I mean...he's done it a lot!)

4. Directing players? He's a guard, sometimes ran the PG spot...easy answer.

Q: Would you rather have FH or a successful 1A high school coach that just knows Xs and Os?

[Newsbreaker]

Re: Fred Hoiberg hired as ISU's new coach!

1. Recruiting...that comes with time and good assistants...anyone can recruit, just like I would for women if I were single...pro's, con's, what can she bring to the table, etc. Recruiting is just about selling yourself and the program. Won't be hard to do with NBA accolades (sp?) and a superior collegiate career.

LOfreakingL. That's it, huh? Just selling yourself. Just like picking up chicks. Plus, you just get good assistants. Most programs don't need that, so there are tons of good assistants just sitting around, waiting to go work for a coach who has never run a program before. Has "Good Recruiting Assistants R' Us" opened in Ames yet?

Let's look at the Assistants he has already. Tons of recruiting and coaching experience there.

All he has to do is recruit though. Just do it. Easy.

3. Like #2, he's probably scouted more film of one NBA game than you and I both have in our entire careers...(exaggerated, but you know what I mean...he's done it a lot!)

You're comparing him to the two of us. This doesn't strike you as odd? The new head men's basketball coach at a major division I college is being seriously compared to the accomplishments of the two of us, and that's the primary justification for his selection as coach?

That is incredible. And hilarious. Mostly hilarious.

Q: Would you rather have FH or a successful 1A high school coach that just knows Xs and Os?

LOL part deux. That's the comparison you are forced to make? Hoiberg or the head man at some school with fourteen hyphens in the name? Good thing there wasn't a range of choices between those two.

Let's go back to the year 2000. Iowa State is the 2 seed and within mere moments of the Final Four. Now, if I would have told you on that date that ten years later ISU fans will be defending their new head coach on the basis that he's better than a 1A high school coach and has studied more film than two random jerks on a message board, would you have laughed? I would have.

This might be the greatest fun I've ever had on here.