Will you feel sorry for Mo. State if they don't get in?

[GonzoCat]

So you think more teams should get in from the 13th rated conference than from the 6th rated one? You think 3 teams whose RPI are all lower than the 3rd and 4th team in the Valley should get the nod over those two?

It's one thing to say the RPI should not be the end all measure, it's another to totally ignore it along with strength of schedule.

Hofstra? Give me a break. You're cherry picking statistics to go against the MVC and in favor of anybody else, do you work for ESPN?

[DancerHall Cat]

So you think more teams should get in from the 13th rated conference than from the 6th rated one? You think 3 teams whose RPI are all lower than the 3rd and 4th team in the Valley should get the nod over those two?

It's one thing to say the RPI should not be the end all measure, it's another to totally ignore it along with strength of schedule.

Hofstra? Give me a break. You're cherry picking statistics to go against the MVC and in favor of anybody else, do you work for ESPN?

Instead of making broad assertions about the MVC getting screwed, take a look at Lunardi's latest bracketology and make an argument about a specific team or so that he thinks should be in.

At that point we can at least debate the spcifics.

[jman2004]

So you think more teams should get in from the 13th rated conference than from the 6th rated one? You think 3 teams whose RPI are all lower than the 3rd and 4th team in the Valley should get the nod over those two?

It's one thing to say the RPI should not be the end all measure, it's another to totally ignore it along with strength of schedule.

Hofstra? Give me a break. You're cherry picking statistics to go against the MVC and in favor of anybody else, do you work for ESPN?

I ABSOLUTELY am not cherry picking statistics to go against the MVC. I want this conference to succeed as much as the rest of you. I would love it if the MVC would get those four bids. But you have to be a little realistic.

I'm not arguing with you that the MVC is a better overall conference than the Colonial. I'd be an idiot. But you have to look at individual teams. And if you do so realistically, I don't see how you could argue against Drexel and Old Dominion (besides their strength of schedules which are significantly lower than both Missouri State and Bradley).

And for the record, I think you're the one who's ignoring RPI. Old Dom is at 37, VCU is at 42 (both above Missouri State and Bradley), and Drexel is lower at 50, but 50 isn't all that bad and considering that Drexel did something neither Missouri State or Bradley could do (beat Creighton) I think you're being a little bias.

[Panthers to the Bone]

MSU is 3-6 against the top 50 RPI
6-3 against 51-100 (it's actually 7-2 with the corrected SLU result...which the Selection Committee views)
1 loss outside the top 100...and only 3 games against the 201+ teams.

I still feel good about MSU getting in. I actually think that Bradley still has a good chance. Top 20 SOS, 21 wins, only 1 game played outside the top 200. Only one loss outside the top 100. 2 top 100 road wins.

[GonzoCat]

I don't know what RPI you are looking at. The one I check, updated thru yesterdays games, has:

35 Mo State
39 Bradley
40 Old Dom
45 Drexel
46 VCU

Obviously they are are bunched together very close. I'm not going to waste any more time worrying about it. You can dissect the numbers lots of different ways and make a case for whichever teams you want to. We'll find out tomorrow.

DancerHall - I gave specifics in my post, if you have poor reading comprehension it's not my fault. Seems like you want to let someone else, Lunardi, do your thinking for you. I bet you listen to talk radio too.

It's simple really, if they go by objective measures the Valley will get 4 teams in. If they go by subjective measures, which they do, there's no way of knowing until you see the brackets revealed. The Valley could get anywhere from 1-4. I've got more important things to do than debate it.

[jman2004]

I check CBS. And the numbers I used are the same ones Lunardi used earlier on ESPN today. Maybe they weren't updated. The Kenpom website matches your numbers. Either way, when they are lumped together like they are, I think you really have to study individual teams. The conferences they play in are just another thing to consider, not the tell all.

I don't know why you're being so hostile. Like I said, I like the Valley just as much as anyone on here. But looking at the three Colonial teams that are rumored to have a good shot at making the tournament, it's hard to take any credit away from them.

If I was on the selection committee Gonzo, I'd side with you and vote in Missouri State and Bradley (who did beat VCU). But I don't think it's fair of us to throw our hands up and cry foul if Drexel and Old Dom go either. They had good seasons (Drexel, like I said earlier, beat Creighton in one chance, something neither Bradley or Missouri State can say with five chances).

As far as I'm concerned, there's going to be about 12-14 teams with pretty strong cases come tomorrow afternoon. Hopefully the Valley will get rewarded for being so balanced this season, but maybe, just maybe, they won't. In which case the fingers could just as easily be pointed at the two Valley schools because Bradley and Missouri State both had plenty of opportunities to better their resumés this season and failed to do so when it mattered.

All in all, I think the selection committee does a pretty good job every year and hopefully this year won't be any different.

[DancerHall Cat]

Obviously they are are bunched together very close. I'm not going to waste any more time worrying about it. You can dissect the numbers lots of different ways and make a case for whichever teams you want to. We'll find out tomorrow.

DancerHall - I gave specifics in my post, if you have poor reading comprehension it's not my fault.

I've got more important things to do than debate it.

Your first post complains that the BCS schools are taking bids from the MVC. Since then, you have spent your posts complaining about teams from non-BCS schools getting in.

As far as you having more important things to do, I am quite sure that you are off to cure cancer and I can only hope that you will find a moment or so to "waste" your time debating such a silly issue.

[Newsbreaker]

If I were in Springfield, I'd be FURIOUS today.

I'm sorry, but I think the selection committee has sent a clear and unmistakable message...there is no benefit to playing in a non-"major", tough top-to-bottom league, because only the top two teams will be rewarded. In fact, the message has been sent that the mid-majors can count on only a handful of at-large bids, no matter how good or bad they are.

CBS showed a graphic this weekend that showed that the number of non-BCS league bids has gone DOWN the last several years, while non-BCS teams continue to make bigger impacts in the tournament.

The fact is, medocrity in the right league (Purdue) will be rewarded while the same is punished (Missouri State/Bradley) in another.

[Coachdags]

If I were in Springfield, I'd be FURIOUS today.

I'm sorry, but I think the selection committee has sent a clear and unmistakable message...there is no benefit to playing in a non-"major", tough top-to-bottom league, because only the top two teams will be rewarded. In fact, the message has been sent that the mid-majors can count on only a handful of at-large bids, no matter how good or bad they are.

CBS showed a graphic this weekend that showed that the number of non-BCS league bids has gone DOWN the last several years, while non-BCS teams continue to make bigger impacts in the tournament.

The fact is, medocrity in the right league (Purdue) will be rewarded while the same is punished (Missouri State/Bradley) in another.

News I Agree...

Do you think Creighton gets in if they lose the Championship game to Southern Ill...?

[Newsbreaker]

I think Creigton was in no matter what. They had a top-20 RPI and were ranked highly.

The best thing that could've happened to the MVC would've been for Bradely/Missouri State/UNI to win the MVC Tourney...that would've given us 3 bids.

[BCPanther]

If Barry Hinson gets fired over this, I hope MSU finishes last in the Valley for the next 20 years. This guy has done everything necessary to get his team in the dance 3 times and they have not gotten in....

[TommyT]

Let's face it

Stanford 18-12 = 11 seed. Do we all really think the Pac-10 deserves 6 teams in? 10-8 conference record? "But the Pac-10 is a very difficult conference that beats up on itself" - seems like some other conference I know. I'll throw this out there. Does Stanford beat Mo. St. or Bradley more than 5 out of 10 games if they played? Don't think so.

Notice how the committee eliminates 2 dangerous mid-major teams by having games matching up teams from non-power conferences? ODU vs Butler and Nevada vs Creighton. Selection committee made sure at least 2 power conference teams don't get embarassed in the first round. Sorry folks, but something stinks this year.

[OhNewby]

The fact is, medocrity in the right league (Purdue) will be rewarded while the same is punished (Missouri State/Bradley) in another.

Purdue got a 9 seed, too! Better than Creighton's 10?!?!?

An RPI based seeding system, gives SIU a 2 seed and Creighton a 5. I don't really like computer polls, but if the system is this biased I wish they would scrap it and use computers.

As expected, it was "Subjective Sunday" and not "Selection Sunday"

Worst case scenario for the Valley. Makes recruiting tough for every Valley school.

[panther2317]

Stanford 18-12 = 11 seed. Do we all really think the Pac-10 deserves 6 teams in? 10-8 conference record? "But the Pac-10 is a very difficult conference that beats up on itself" - seems like some other conference I know. I'll throw this out there. Does Stanford beat Mo. St. or Bradley more than 5 out of 10 games if they played? Don't think so.

Notice how the committee eliminates 2 dangerous mid-major teams by having games matching up teams from non-power conferences? ODU vs Butler and Nevada vs Creighton. Selection committee made sure at least 2 power conference teams don't get embarassed in the first round. Sorry folks, but something stinks this year.

Missouri State beat Stanford last season by 20+ points in the NIT.

[panther2317]

Purdue lost to Indiana State. Enough said.