I would like to set a couple things straight.

[DancerHall Cat]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

[QUOTE=Brett Crawford;110106]I would agree with most everything you said there... No argument from this guy... I think his energy is a great thing and the team benefits from it, no doubt.
QUOTE]


If only he could carry that energy into the offseason and get himself in shape.

[Khan4Cats]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

Coleman is a senior. Well, the question was "besides he's a senior", so good first choice. Guess we should start Viet, too.

Coleman has started for 3 seasons and has improved in each. Define "improved", his scoring has gone up 10.7, 11.5, to 13.1 (of course the first two years he was a third or even fourth option), his free throw shooting has gone all the way from 48% up to 61%, his rebounding has gone up 6.4 to 9.1, of course his assists have gone down (63-56-52), his turnovers have gone up (53-60-75) and his stamina hasn't improved any.

Coleman is this team's best scoring threat. Depending on how he's defended and where he's at. If he's away from the hoop, I don't think too many teams are worried about him scoring.

Coleman is this team's strongest rebounder. Definitely agree here

Coleman is this team's fiercest shot blocker. Agree as well, though his eagerness to make a block often leaves him out of position on defense for putbacks or dump passes.

And the biggest reason of all is the same reason we all watched Brooks McKowen start every game last season . . . (You almost ALWAYS came to Brooks' defense on here last year, why is it so difficult to come to Coleman's?) Is anyone really questioning how much we miss Brooks this year? I was laughed at earlier this year when I said we would miss Brooks more than Stout. Or was I totally off on that? Is there really that much hatred towards Brooks still?

Coleman's is this team's leader. He's this team's emotional spark. He's the one that get's this team fired up. The crowd loves his play. More times than not he has picked this team up and placed them on his shoulders. Again, I agree, when his head is in the game. Which sometimes only appears for a few minutes in each game. Unfortunately, there are just as many times when he mopes around or would rather complain with officials or jaw with opponents.

The best reason of all . . . 82% of PantherNation thinks so.

The question really should be, who should he start in place of and does it really make us better?

Josten? No, obviously.

Dunham/Brown/Montgomery et al? Different position as well, unless Koch slides to a 3.

Koch? No, as well. Though he could slide to the 3 spot over another guard, not sure it makes us 'better' long term because of substitution and match-up issues.

Eglseder? Eric certainly has more aggression, but I have already commented that I think it might lead to fewer opportunities for Jordan, especially against the likes of Drake, who doesn't really even have one true post player, or other teams. Might be temporarily better for a few games.

But, I forgot. He's a senior.

[jman2004]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

Everything I posted has been "Dissected?" As in "no you're an idiot and your OPINION is wrong", dissected? No one has countered anything I posted other than to be shocked that I pointed out any deficiencies in their deity. I gave my reasons for how I would put together my TEAM, that is after all, the concept of the game despite what the Allen Iverson's, Kobe Bryant's and many NBA'er's have devoled it into at that level. There is a reason why San Antonio wins all the time.

As for responding to what "you're offering in return" how am I supposed to respond? "No, I'm not stupid, you are?" Sorry, I don't really want to get into name calling. I state my opinion, you state yours, so be it. But to say that I clearly can't be right because I might be in the 17% group, that's not an argument.

And what, exactly, has Jake done to Coleman's senior year and how does that compare to what Jake has done for the good of the TEAM. If Coleman is really such a selfish player that having the little start by his name for starting or having his name called is that big a deal, maybe its good that he graduates this year. I don't think he is nearly as selfish as some of the posters on this site apparently are in taking such great offense for him. Coleman has said he will do what the coaches have asked of him for what is best for the team, I believe him. People want to make a conspiracy of it.

And as for the question of can Coleman still get effective minutes and still start? Yes, I have answered that and I believe that yes, Coleman could still get his effective minutes by starting. But I don't think Koch or Eglseder would be as effective if either of them came off the bench.
Now, starting all three would be something I could entertain, even playing some zone as I have advocated. But that leads to a bigger problem of who do we substitute in for who? Especially if both Jordan and Eric need a break at the same time.

I don't understand why you are wanting to make this so personal. Did I call you an "idiot"? I've responded to and questioned just about everything in the last few days and you don't answer anything about it. Instead you twist my words and argument around and make it childish.

I never called you "stupid". Some of what you're saying is illogical and stupid but you usually have quite a bit of good stuff to add to this board. I'm just having difficulty keeping up with some of the "arguments" you're spinning lately. A lot of them really detract from what anyone's actually saying.

No one is saying Coleman is selfish. A lot of people just think it's dumb that he doesn't start all of a sudden this year. Eric has handled himself well.

[Deke3]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

Brett, seriously, you really are better than this. Why are you choosing this route?

Coleman is a senior.

Coleman has started for 3 seasons and has improved in each.

Coleman is this team's best scoring threat.

Coleman is this team's strongest rebounder.

Coleman is this team's fiercest shot blocker.

And the biggest reason of all is the same reason we all watched Brooks McKowen start every game last season . . . (You almost ALWAYS came to Brooks' defense on here last year, why is it so difficult to come to Coleman's?)

Coleman's is this team's leader. He's this team's emotional spark. He's the one that get's this team fired up. The crowd loves his play. More times than not he has picked this team up and placed them on his shoulders.

The best reason of all . . . 82% of PantherNation thinks so.

Oh...are we talking about Brooks McKowen again? That was a fun exchange of posts...who do you think it will be next year?

[BCPanther]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

If only he could carry that energy into the offseason and get himself in shape.

I agree completely DHC!!

I love going back and forth with you, I may question some of your opinions, as you do mine, but down deep we are just a couple of passionate Panther fans...

[jman2004]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

The question really should be, who should he start in place of and does it really make us better?

Josten? No, obviously.

Dunham/Brown/Montgomery et al? Different position as well, unless Koch slides to a 3.

Koch? No, as well. Though he could slide to the 3 spot over another guard, not sure it makes us 'better' long term because of substitution and match-up issues.

Eglseder? Eric certainly has more aggression, but I have already commented that I think it might lead to fewer opportunities for Jordan, especially against the likes of Drake, who doesn't really even have one true post player, or other teams. Might be temporarily better for a few games.

But, I forgot. He's a senior.

You ask "who should he start in place of?" and that is ! Why should he start in place of anyone. He never has had to and it's ALWAYS worked out just fine! Why suddenly in his senior year did this need to be messed with?

I don't care. I'm done with you. It's gotten to a point where you're difficult to even talk with because you find a word or two in my posts that you key in on and TOTALLY DISREGARD everything else I wrote. You are so grasping at straws here and EVERYONE can see it. All I hope is that eventually you see it as well and come to your senses. As far as me and you on THIS particular topic, I'm done for now.

[jman2004]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

Oh...are we talking about Brooks McKowen again? That was a fun exchange of posts...who do you think it will be next year?

What did I say about McKowen that pushed you into a headbanging fit?

He was our leader last year and he started.

Coleman is our leader this season and he doesn't start.

I wasn't implying anything about Brooks'. You implied that.

[Khan4Cats]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

And BTW, again, the question was not answered. It's easier I guess for those that are okay with Coleman not starting to reword questions, reask questions, defend Jacobson blindly, and twist and turn statistics in their favor than it is to answer any questions straight up.

Was Coleman starting ever really a problem and could Jordan and Eric have been used in similar situations and minutes if their starting roles were reversed? Basically, was this switch in lineups and mindset actually EVER really NECESSARY?

What hasn't been answered?

Was Coleman starting a problem? Why would it have to be to make a change? Might the coaches be doing something that they believe is best for the TEAM as a whole? I think yes. Was Coleman starting always the BEST thing for the team? Not always, I seem to recall having slow starts last year even with him in the starting line-up, maybe its not that but something else.

Could Jordan and Eric have been used in similar situations and minutes if their starting roles were reversed? Again, I have answered this and answered this. Yes, they might be used in reverse roles, but I just don't get the feeling that Jordan would be as productive that way. Can't explain or quantify why I feel that way, other than to worry that he might not even see the floor against some teams, just do.

Basically, was this switch in lineups and mindset actually EVER really NECESSARY? Well, we showed some success in Thailand when Jake tried this change, and we have basically carried that success over to this season for the most part, so I'll say yes. It's actually kind of funny because it seems like so many people want a change in mindset and philosophy on offense, so why wouldn't we want other changes, too? I guess I would like to see some more variety and creativity in play calling and even defense, too.

Or have I still not answered questions? Again.

[jman2004]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

That's the first time you've attempted the 1st and 3rd one. And like the 2nd, I don't agree with any of it. There are no statistics to back it up and it's all just an opinion of yours. "I don't feel that Jordan would play very much." Well that's great, but it's an opinion. You don't need to twist people's words around and twist ACTUAL statistics around (like when you proved for me that Coleman improved every year in many categories). Just state your opinion for what it is, an opinion.

Can we go back to being civil? I don't want to argue this indepthly with Panther fans. I like arguing, but not like this.

[Khan4Cats]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

That's the first time you've attempted the 1st and 3rd one. And like the 2nd, I don't agree with any of it. There are no statistics to back it up and it's all just an opinion of yours. "I don't feel that Jordan would play very much." Well that's great, but it's an opinion. You don't need to twist people's words around and twist ACTUAL statistics around (like when you proved for me that Coleman improved every year in many categories). Just state your opinion for what it is, an opinion.

Can we go back to being civil? I don't want to argue this indepthly with Panther fans. I like arguing, but not like this.

I have actually tried the first one in various ways, it just usually gets tossed aside as "you're just blindly following the coach?"

As for the statistics, I did show both improvement and decline. You had simply stated that he had "continually" improved, I pointed out areas where that was not true, while also pointing out areas where he has improved, and I didn't even add his free throw shooting for this year which, until yesterday's 1-4, has been much improved.

Towards civility. I am all for that, just that I had a couple of PM's that decided to attack me personally. I have tried to stay away from calling anyone names, even if I disagree with what someone is saying. I am glad you mentioned that a lot of what I have said is my OPINION, which it is, and I have stated it as that several times. Opinions are what most of what everyone else says on here as well. I try to keep that in mind when debating others on this board, I wish more would keep it in mind when dealing with me.
I will continue to post what I think, observe, feel, hope for, would like to see, etc. and I agree with you that I hope it can remain civil. If you feel I have personally attacked you, I apologize, I have simply been trying to defend myself.

[clenz]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

Why did this thread turn into the Should Coleman Start thread?

again I ask this question

[Waverly_Panther]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

again I ask this question

Probably because that is all anyone really wants to talk about. Biggest controversy and all that. But, there is another thread for that.

[clenz]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

exactly my point

[Newsbreaker]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

This place is very combative.

[jman2004]

Re: I would like to set a couple things straight.

I have actually tried the first one in various ways, it just usually gets tossed aside as "you're just blindly following the coach?"

As for the statistics, I did show both improvement and decline. You had simply stated that he had "continually" improved, I pointed out areas where that was not true, while also pointing out areas where he has improved, and I didn't even add his free throw shooting for this year which, until yesterday's 1-4, has been much improved.

Towards civility. I am all for that, just that I had a couple of PM's that decided to attack me personally. I have tried to stay away from calling anyone names, even if I disagree with what someone is saying. I am glad you mentioned that a lot of what I have said is my OPINION, which it is, and I have stated it as that several times. Opinions are what most of what everyone else says on here as well. I try to keep that in mind when debating others on this board, I wish more would keep it in mind when dealing with me.
I will continue to post what I think, observe, feel, hope for, would like to see, etc. and I agree with you that I hope it can remain civil. If you feel I have personally attacked you, I apologize, I have simply been trying to defend myself.

I wasn't one that sent you a PM and if I singled you out too much, I too apologize. I was just trying to defend my opinion on this matter.