What's it gonna take?

[northwest iowa panther]

Re: What's it gonna take?

I have always described recruiting as the pyramid principle. Think of the pyramid filled with only division one talent. The very top of the pyramid are the players everyone wants, 4 to 5 stars, academicallly inclined and no social baggage.The players in the layer directly below the top of the pyramid may still be 5 star but are not so academically inclined or you start to see some social problems with them. As the pyramid widens toward the bottom the stars start to drop off or the academic and social issues become a problem. There are far more at the bottom that do not carry many stars but are possibly more academically inclined and are willing to stay the course with no social issues.

There are 300 plus division one schools all wanting the few at the top. At anyone time there are 4,000 student/athletes on division one rosters. Simple supply and demand tells a person that the majority of basketball players on those rosters came from the middle to bottom of the pyramid. Rarely does a top of the pyramid player fall down the layers. It happens but rarely. UNI depends on those at the bottom, a Tuttle, to spend the time in college to climb to the top.

[Username]

Re: What's it gonna take?

Think you guys are forgetting we had a 5 year irrelevancy after beating Kansas. One good season does not build a team. If they string 3-4 in a row (like aforementioned WSU, Butler, VCU), that's when you see people buying the hype. I will agree the process is sped up when you beat top 5 teams.

[Blue42]

Re: What's it gonna take?

I don't think it's terribly easy to play for Jake. He demands out of this world conditioning and weight work and an all out commitment to defense with no guarantees your going to see the ball much on offense.

He's obviously not a guy that screams and yells but he's still a tough guy to play for. There's lots of those 4 star kids who don't have the desire to do those things.

Good point. I think that's accurate.

Jake is demanding. Not everyone wants to play for a guy like that.

If you pay your dues in Jake's system...he'll give you a ton of rope. Like Jespersen said after last night's game...Coach gives him the green light anytime because he's put the time in.

Nothing's given...but once it's earned Jake will trust you more than most guys. That's a fair deal...but not one every kid will sign up for.

[Mudrafan]

Re: What's it gonna take?

If there is one factor that holds UNI back it seems to me it has been our inability to attract higher level recruits. Other programs (Gonzaga, Butler, VCU, WSU) have gotten better recruits after they achieved a level of success no higher than what UNI has done to date. That has enabled them to sustain a higher level of success for a longer period, at least until they lost the coach that did it.

This year we've beaten two top 5 teams on national TV. Last year we were the talk of the nation most of the year with our all american player, top 10 ranking and ridiculous record. Going back we had the Kansas win that made us the talk of the tourney that year. Anyone who follows college bb knows we have one of the best coaches in the country. It doesn't seem like any of it has translated to any out of state high level recruits saying "I want to play at UNI".

I love the players we have and I'm not a huge fan of the star system, but it certainly has some degree of validity. I'm not expecting us to ever bag a McDonalds all american, but I'd love to see what Jake could do with a few 4 star recruits that fit his system. A bigger, stronger version of Seth Tuttle if you will.

Ever since Hoiberg arrived at ISU, with his zero coaching background, they have been able to attract these type players by the bus load. I'm not saying I'd want many of the players that have gone there, some have had one eye on the NBA from the beginning, some have been of dubious character, and some don't have the work ethic Jake requires. I'm just saying I'd like some of those type players to consider UNI, I trust Jake to sort out which ones have what it takes beyond raw talent to fit in.

And I'm wondering when if ever we will see it happen.

It's going to take an explosion in the population of Iowa & that is not likely going to happen. Other schools like Butler live around large population centers. We do not. As a result, we have to pull players in from five-plus hours. That is not going to change. One thing we could do is be a little more aggressive in JC recruiting.

[ban basketball]

Re: What's it gonna take?

We're more likely to see Ban admit he's wrong than see a consistent turn out in the McLeod from this fan base.

Admitted I'm wrong on here on many occasions. In fact, I just admitted that I was in error on here a few days ago.

Selective attention, or a reading comprehension problem? Given your postings, both of which are very valid possibilities.

[run&blade]

Re: What's it gonna take?

Search out the transfers and non traditional recruits more.

Washpun and Jespersen (UNI's two best players by far are transfers).

I don't think UNI can recruit against power five schools and win kids over consistently enough to compete at a high level.

Needs to be a mix of all types. Take the transfers away and UNI would look Damn average.

[SteinPizza]

Re: What's it gonna take?

Search out the transfers and non traditional recruits more.

Washpun and Jespersen (UNI's two best players by far are transfers).

I don't think UNI can recruit against power five schools and win kids over consistently enough to compete at a high level.

Needs to be a mix of all types. Take the transfers away and UNI would look Damn average.

This is largely correct. Washpun is our best playmaker, by far, bar none. Without him, many of our good players would be average. The threat he poses to the defense makes everyone around him better. We don't want to live and die by transfers, but there's a reason he was originally sought after by P5 schools.

[06panther10]

Search out the transfers and non traditional recruits more.

Washpun and Jespersen (UNI's two best players by far are transfers).

I don't think UNI can recruit against power five schools and win kids over consistently enough to compete at a high level.

Needs to be a mix of all types. Take the transfers away and UNI would look Damn average.

In other words, just keep doing what we are doing now...

[dan_beeding]

Re: What's it gonna take?

In other words, just keep doing what we are doing now...

And do whatever it takes to keep the greatest coach in our history in Cedar Falls.

[run&blade]

Re: What's it gonna take?

In other words, just keep doing what we are doing now...

No, do it more.

Sure Austin didn't pan out and big deal, worth the risk.

The bench is always full of guys that will never see meaningful minutes. Take risks on guys that you know can play and hope they get their head straight.

[dan_beeding]

Re: What's it gonna take?

No, do it more.

Sure Austin didn't pan out and big deal, worth the risk.

The bench is always full of guys that will never see meaningful minutes. Take risks on guys that you know can play and hope they get their head straight.

Our bench from 2 and 3 years ago was made up of today's important players for the most part. I don't disagree about taking a flyer or two on some transfers but we are not a program that can afford the AA situation happening more than once every few years.

[cydave]

Re: What's it gonna take?

No, do it more.

Sure Austin didn't pan out and big deal, worth the risk.

The bench is always full of guys that will never see meaningful minutes. Take risks on guys that you know can play and hope they get their head straight.

Be careful. UNI might start getting a lot of crap about being Transfer U and not doing it "the right way" according to Hawk fans.

[run&blade]

Re: What's it gonna take?

Be careful. UNI might start getting a lot of crap about being Transfer U and not doing it "the right way" according to Hawk fans.

That stuff is stupid talk. Some transfers are able to transfer because they already have a degree so they are not dumb jocks.

All these kids get an education for free and academic help and all kinds of perks normal students don't. If they fail to take advantage of that it is the students fault not the programs.

[Trapped in California]

Ask Rick Patino how he does it? Hundred dollar handshakes, strippers, new cars, etc...

From my NSA monitored nexus 5

[OhNewby]

Re: What's it gonna take?

Not to try to derail the thread, but I think we are getting pretty high-level recruits. I think the idea that the star rating system has much validity at all is pretty suspect.

First, it tends to rate kids based on who they are at age 17, not capturing their ceiling or lack there of. Also, there are so many examples of ridiculous rating. Morgan's a 2 star, Jok's a 3 star. Gessel and Woodbury are 4 stars.