Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

[Alum 99']

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

This needs to be a mandate by the NCAA....that would make it a level playing field...I am talking both athletes and full ride academic scholarships...if a student doesn't want to put the time in for a degree they aren't going to get one..i too had coaches in my living room but never was promised a degree..i was told that they were a good school and getting a degree from there would mean something..i doubt many coaches PROMISE degrees from institutions...

[JayJ79]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

No coach is going to PROMISE a degree.
They can tout statistics such as the fact that a high percentage of students/athletes DO graduate from their school. But you can't guarantee it, because it depends more on the individual student than on the instituion itself.

If a scholarship student gets in trouble, then yank any of their future scholarship money. But yanking previous scholarship money is stupid.

If you give a scholarship to an athlete, and they end up not performing up to expectations on the field, are you going to make them pay back their scholarship money too?

[Alum 99']

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

I still say take all scholarship money away and turn into a loan...then they always have in the back of their mind that this can happen whether they are a freshman or a senior...Expectations on the field are completely different..the coach made the desicion to give the athlete the scholarship....a lot of this is done on raw talent and potential..a coach never truely knows what he is going to get on the field from athletes he looks at from high schools...you also have the athletes that caoches don't see the potential and turn out to be stars...Eric Sanders...

[Back2BackCats]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

JC - who would you hold responsible for the repayment, the student who signed with the University or the parents. I can tell you I think I raised some pretty good kids but I don't want to be responsible for all of their actions. I think the other issue is where the funds will com from even if you did hold the parents responsible, the only reason some of these kids get the opportunity to attend school is because of their athletic ability and they wouldn't have the funds to repay anyway.

A99 - I think you are right, you are not promised a degree but you are promised an education and that is open to interpretation. If that promise is made doesn't the school now have some responsibility to make sure you receive that education, maybe not but how can all of the responsibility fall on the athlete.

This is just my opinion guys, I am enjoying the conversation.

[Purrrrrfect]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

JC - who would you hold responsible for the repayment, the student who signed with the University or the parents. I can tell you I think I raised some pretty good kids but I don't want to be responsible for all of their actions. I think the other issue is where the funds will com from even if you did hold the parents responsible, the only reason some of these kids get the opportunity to attend school is because of their athletic ability and they wouldn't have the funds to repay anyway.

A99 - I think you are right, you are not promised a degree but you are promised an education and that is open to interpretation. If that promise is made doesn't the school now have some responsibility to make sure you receive that education, maybe not but how can all of the responsibility fall on the athlete.

This is just my opinion guys, I am enjoying the conversation.

as a student, many like you prob. once were, I must pay for my full education (all 70k in debt i am). A rule set forth by the parents to all the children of the family to learn about responsibility and earning what you work for. I solely would expect the student athletes to pay it all back themselves. Their loss, not the parents.

[JCPanthers]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

JC - who would you hold responsible for the repayment, the student who signed with the University or the parents.

The student who signed the letter of intent.

I agree with Alum '99....this can't be a UNI thing, this has to come from the NCAA.

[Back2BackCats]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

as a student, many like you prob. once were, I must pay for my full education (all 70k in debt i am). A rule set forth by the parents to all the children of the family to learn about responsibility and earning what you work for. I solely would expect the student athletes to pay it all back themselves. Their loss, not the parents.

But how would you do that, you have shown responsibility for actually wanting an education and I assume you have applied for loans with the intent of paying that back after you have received your education. The athletes have not applied for a loan and some would probably drop out of school if they had to pay for it. Would the scholarship transfer to a loan or would you garnish future wages? Would you have to pay it all back or only the semester that you got in trouble, would you be able to factor in the revenue you helped generate for the school? Way too complicated, the school takes a risk offering scholarships and has to accept some of the blame. They can toss them out or sit them down but I don't think they get their money back. We can discuss it but it's not going to change.

[JCPanthers]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

If you give a scholarship to an athlete, and they end up not performing up to expectations on the field, are you going to make them pay back their scholarship money too?

Doing and dealing drugs is a big difference then not living up to expectations....so no, I wouldn't expect them to pay back their scholarship money.

[Alum 99']

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

You hold the student responsible..they are 18 and need to understand responsibility...if i would have crapped my education away..i know i would be responsible..not my parents

[catsfann]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

Alum '99 and JCPanthers, the only way I could even begin to understand your logic in punishment is if the students in question were given free rides. Student-Athletes may be given full rides but their scholarships are not free rides. How can you ask these students to repay the scholarships when up until the arrests they had fulfilled all that was asked of them? They met all academic and athletic requirements asked of them. They did their part and put in the vast time required to receive their scholarship and they should be kept.

Using your logic a company could say, JCPanther you were arrested yesterday, your salary for the last 20 years has now turned into a loan you are required to pay back. I would think you would feel this to be unfair because you met all the requirements and did the work your employer asked of you up until your arrest.

If Johnny is convicted, he will lose his scholarship, face possible jail time, have to pay fines, and face great public embarrassment. Hopefully that will be enough to make him learn from his mistake and correct it. Sadly judging by some responses being arrested, convicted of possible felonies, learning from mistakes, and correcting behaviors isn’t enough for you. I ask you what else are you owed??? Maybe we could do a public flogging under the campanile; for every thousand dollars you donated to UNI you get to lash him once. Cause goll dang it that man made a mistake and I’m gunna surrre make it hurt um tell I feel better.

[MediaPanther]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

...and the same can be said for pot.

I'm inclined to agree with the libertarian views on this one.

You're not comparing apples to apples here. Alcohol was legal and then made illegal, then once prohibition led to gangsters and mobs taking over major cities and killing like crazy it was legalized again.

No Amendment has ever mentioned pot. It's not the same situation.

I really don't have a beef with legalizing it, I just don't agree it's the same as alcohol.

[dan_beeding]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

I really don't have a beef with legalizing it, I just don't agree it's the same as alcohol.

No. Beer doesn't make you want to hit the McDonald's dollar menu with a $50 spot.

[JayJ79]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

Using your logic a company could say, JCPanther you were arrested yesterday, your salary for the last 20 years has now turned into a loan you are required to pay back. I would think you would feel this to be unfair because you met all the requirements and did the work your employer asked of you up until your arrest.

excellent comparison!

[Alum 99']

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

Catsfann...I'm sorry but I do not think that is a good comparison..You are hired for your job and do a task everyday to make that money....Students on scholarship are given the CHANCE to receive an education for free..which in turn will hopefully get them a paying job...If you tell that student from day one that if you get kicked out of school or off a team your tuition is accruing and you will have to pay the bill...It seems nothing else is working as athletes all over the country are always getting in trouble...

[TH1974]

Re: Johnny Gray, Victor Williams Suspended

Catsfann...I'm sorry but I do not think that is a good comparison..You are hired for your job and do a task everyday to make that money....Students on scholarship are given the CHANCE to receive an education for free..which in turn will hopefully get them a paying job...If you tell that student from day one that if you get kicked out of school or off a team your tuition is accruing and you will have to pay the bill...It seems nothing else is working as athletes all over the country are always getting in trouble...

Correct. It's a terrible comparison. That said, I don't think athletes in trouble should repay their tuition. It's a ridiculous notion, really.