UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

[Newsbreaker]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

As far as contradictions do you mean like extolling the virtue of Big 10/11 academics, and protesting how the academic side of the invitations will play a central role....Then trying to excuse the invites to lesser institutions by doing a media study about the television revenues that Missouri would bring to the conference....

How hard is this to understand. There are multiple factors. Insufficient academics is a disqualifying factor - if a school (example: Texas Tech) wanted to come to the Big Ten, even when adding tons of TV revenue and the like, they would be rebuffed because of insufficient academics.

I understand not everyone has learned "creative thinking" where multiple pieces of information and various unrelated factors are pieced together to reach a conclusion, but the fact that you can't understand that TV is important, but academics are also important, and that both are factors in a larger institutional decision by the league, is a bit stunning.

Look at the current decision made by the league. Missouri adds more immediate, BTN revenue than UNL does. The addition of UNL has more impact on ESPN negotiations, but adds fewer TV's immediately to the Big Ten. Mizzou has been left at the alter for UNL, in part, because UNL is a much better academic fit than Mizzou. Do you see how both factors (and many others) were at play?

It's OK News, I know that discussing actual UNI sports is something you rarely do anyway unless it's to defend the Hawks or, criticize the budget issues....So I certainly wouldn't want you to start now when this problem will be caused by the very thing that you love and defend...

I just discussed UNI. You're increasingly looking like a silly troll here.

Nothing in your post has been avoided. You haven't asked a question that hasn't been addressed directly and sufficiently. You also haven't provided any of the links I have requested of you (because they don't exist, and we both know it). Keep digging, buddy boy.

[Kyle]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

PTTB- Thank you for giving me a reason to continue reading this thread.

[cydave]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

Now that you've confirmed you don't care about facts----

What the hell are you talking about?

[Newsbreaker]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I honestly don't think that there were any serious objections in moving the MVC tourney to KC on a rotation basis, based on the fact that the Big 12 Tourney was there every couple years. I don't think the MVC Tourney would ever move exclusively to KC, with the MVC offices in STL and such a tradition of the tourney being there.

IMHO, the "issue" with Kansas City is that nobody in the Valley office is sleeping with someone whose job it is to bring events to KC.

[Panthers to the Bone]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

IMHO, the "issue" with Kansas City is that nobody in the Valley office is sleeping with someone whose job it is to bring events to KC.

Haha! Legit thought, but unproven if that's the real reason! For clarification, it's a husband/wife relationship!

Here is the first I've seen of someone (not sure who) thinking UNI might be headed to another conference.

http://twitter.com/jasonmeeker/status/15964186813

[06panther10]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

The WAC is a terrible basketball conference. That would be a downgrade for us.

[SteinPizza]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

But in your giddiness ON A UNI SITE, you don't even have the stones to discuss what this will mean to Panther athletics, especially football....

'96, I know this wasn't in response to me, but I don't get your argument about how Iowa State downgrading in conference status will adversely affect UNI football. They'll still have to recruit kids from Texas, etc., to compete effectively in whatever league they end up in. The state of Iowa just doesn't produce enough high level D1 football talent, period.

Actually, Iowa State and Iowa both being strong helps UNI. If they're both successful, they tend to take risks on out of state players who are more talented than those in Iowa. Or, put another way, they tend to go for players who are more coveted/highly regarded than those in Iowa. If they're in a weaker position, they sign the in state kid. I'm talking about the typical 2 or 3 star Iowa high school player, not someone like Tavian Banks or Adrian Arrington who could've gone anywhere they wanted. Bottom line is UNI benefits by signing players who would've otherwise gone to Iowa or ISU if they're in a down period. This is more applicable to Iowa, since Iowa's the stronger program and has been traditionally. But, if Paul Rhodes keeps his forward momentum at ISU, the same will be true.

[jegbomb52]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I don't know if the pro's of going to the WAC in football would be worth the cons of going to WAC in basketball. It would be an interesting thought. Also, the other day I was talking to someone who is very familiar with the in's and out's of football classifications. Remember how someone has said before that you have to have a home stadium of X amount of seats? Well, here is how schools get away with it. Lets take the "MAC" for example. Once every four years, a MAC school plays a home game in a NFL stadium, Northern Illinois vs Iowa is an example of this a few years back. Northern Illinois got to use that game for the NCAA attendence requirement. The directional Michigan schools each play one game a year in the Ford Dome in Detroit, Buffalo at Buffalo's stadium. Ohio MAC schools in Cleveland. If we would join the MAC, or the WAC, we would just set up a two year agreement with a, I don't know, Hawaii at Arrowhead. All of a sudden, our 16,800 seat dome is just fine for a FBS stadium.

[jegbomb52]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

'96, I know this wasn't in response to me, but I don't get your argument about how Iowa State downgrading in conference status will adversely affect UNI football. They'll still have to recruit kids from Texas, etc., to compete effectively in whatever league they end up in. The state of Iowa just doesn't produce enough high level D1 football talent, period.

Actually, Iowa State and Iowa both being strong helps UNI. If they're both successful, they tend to take risks on out of state players who are more talented than those in Iowa. Or, put another way, they tend to go for players who are more coveted/highly regarded than those in Iowa. If they're in a weaker position, they sign the in state kid. I'm talking about the typical 2 or 3 star Iowa high school player, not someone like Tavian Banks or Adrian Arrington who could've gone anywhere they wanted. Bottom line is UNI benefits by signing players who would've otherwise gone to Iowa or ISU if they're in a down period. This is more applicable to Iowa, since Iowa's the stronger program and has been traditionally. But, if Paul Rhodes keeps his forward momentum at ISU, the same will be true.

Stein, couldn't disagree with you more. Guys that aren't good enough to go to Iowa in Iowa's good years, but good enough in down years, aren't at UNI either. Those guys end up in DeKalb at Northern Illinois, or UTEP, or Tulsa, some place like that. The players that are in state that we compete for are the kids that have an opportunity to walk on at Iowa or Iowa State, or take a tuition scholly, or a books / meal scholly at UNI. In this scenario (I believe to be more of a common scenario than yours) we want Iowa and Iowa State to be down.

[SteinPizza]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

Stein, couldn't disagree with you more. Guys that aren't good enough to go to Iowa in Iowa's good years, but good enough in down years, aren't at UNI either. Those guys end up in DeKalb at Northern Illinois, or UTEP, or Tulsa, some place like that. The players that are in state that we compete for are the kids that have an opportunity to walk on at Iowa or Iowa State, or take a tuition scholly, or a books / meal scholly at UNI. In this scenario (I believe to be more of a common scenario than yours) we want Iowa and Iowa State to be down.

I see your point Jeg, and it's well made. You have to admit though that there are guys on our roster (and in the past) who would have been offered by Iowa if Iowa was playing at the level of Bob Cummings in the 70s vs. Fry/Ferentz today. Also, to my knowledge schools like Northern Ill, Tulsa, etc. don't recruit heavily in Iowa at all. I kind of semi-keep up with Northern since they're in the area, and I've never heard of an Iowa kid doing anything there, or even being signed. I'm a little suprised by that, to be honest.

[jegbomb52]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I see your point Jeg, and it's well made. You have to admit though that there are guys on our roster (and in the past) who would have been offered by Iowa if Iowa was playing at the level of Bob Cummings in the 70s vs. Fry/Ferentz today. Also, to my knowledge schools like Northern Ill, Tulsa, etc. don't recruit heavily in Iowa at all. I kind of semi-keep up with Northern since they're in the area, and I've never heard of an Iowa kid doing anything there, or even being signed. I'm a little suprised by that, to be honest.

I believe NIU signed Charles Johnson out of NU High 6-7 years ago before he transferred to UNI. I guess I am just not familiar with the "Cummings era" of Iowa Football (I was born in 1980), but I do see your point. There are several on UNI's starting 22 each year that would start at Iowa and ISU on any given year, more so on ISU's. The biggest thing I think is how much publicity they are getting out of school. Others simply might not get their shot due to height, weight, speed in high school. Some simply would get a shot out of a JUCO at a BCS school if they had proven themselves but sometimes until they are proven teams won't take a risk.

I don't know, I still want them down. We might have to agree to disagree.

[TH1974]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I think you guys are both making sense, and really, you both are probably right to some extent. I don't think it's a hard-and-fast situation where UNI is definitely better one way or the other. It varies from year-to-year and from kid-to-kid, and even position-to-position. If ISU (or UI) is down, one player might be more inclined to end up there, knowing that he'd have more opportunity to play and have a shot to play in the Big XII or Big Ten (which is which these days?). Another player might rather play for a top-5 FCS UNI team instead of a 9th-or-10th place Big 10/12 team.

That's my take on the current situation and conference affiliations. If ISU moves to the MWC or MAC, the same type of arguments could apply. A kid might rather play for a chance at a FCS championship at UNI than for a Papa John's bowl win at mid-major ISU.

[Panther-Sheik]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I don't know if the pro's of going to the WAC in football would be worth the cons of going to WAC in basketball.

What would the pros of going to the WAC be? I have been thinking of this and can't really come up with a real positive, that I know of. It seems like there really wouldn't be any financial incentive after all the scholarships and travel we woudl have to fund. Also, I heard that you just need to average 15,000 in attendance at least every other year to be FBS. I think we might have done it a couple years ago, but not sure.

[Cat80]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

What the hell are you talking about?

You posted information which was incorrect. Your post stated Villanova and Georgetown do not have football teams. That's incorrect. I had a little fun with it regarding FCS football teams and you went ballistic.

[Cat80]

Re: UNI to join a conference with Kansas and ISU?

I think you guys are both making sense, and really, you both are probably right to some extent. I don't think it's a hard-and-fast situation where UNI is definitely better one way or the other. It varies from year-to-year and from kid-to-kid, and even position-to-position. If ISU (or UI) is down, one player might be more inclined to end up there, knowing that he'd have more opportunity to play and have a shot to play in the Big XII or Big Ten (which is which these days?). Another player might rather play for a top-5 FCS UNI team instead of a 9th-or-10th place Big 10/12 team.

That's my take on the current situation and conference affiliations. If ISU moves to the MWC or MAC, the same type of arguments could apply. A kid might rather play for a chance at a FCS championship at UNI than for a Papa John's bowl win at mid-major ISU.

Another factor is who/where the coaching staffs at Iowa and ISU go after. Walden and apparently Chizik didn't focus on Iowa players like McCarney seemed to. This might have allowed UNI to get players we wouldn't if ISU were recruiting them. Iowa always goes after the elite Iowa kids, but ISU has gone back and forth. In addition to conference affiliation, who ISU recruits has an affect on UNI as well.